(00:18) Hello and welcome to Whose Turners Anyway, a podcast all about our gaming group and of course board games. I am your current first player, Dan, and I'm joined by the lovely Adrian. Hello. I'm joined by Beex. >> Hi. And I'm joined by the mighty Curly. >> The Mighty Curly. >> Ah, yes. Hello.
(00:34)  Hello. We're going to talk about board games and our main topic today, which is board gaming regrets. I have many. Hashtag lots. Um, but before we go before we go through all that, um, how are we all doing today? >> Great. Thank you. >> Recovering from a cold, which it sounds like there's a couple of us, so I think we might all be a bit nah down the mic, but >> yeah, it's that it's that time of year still, isn't it? you know, and I I don't I think it's been like the 58th of January forever, even though it's now February and it's rained every day this
(01:02) year so far. >> It's Yeah. The good thing is that cuz I haven't felt like doing anything is I've caught up on a lot of TV. >> Nice. >> But cuz I've not been very well, I've done the thing where you're watching a TV show, you've watched a few episodes, then you fall asleep >> and then Amazon Prime or whatever has moved on a few episodes, you wake up, you're like, "Well, I want to watch Amazon.
(01:24)  I want to go back to where I was." But you can't remember what episode number you >> Amazon Prime is good but it's not that good then you know when you Yeah, exactly. So you're then like looking back through the episodes that you've just recently has recently played to work out which one you've watched. I feel like I've done that at least 20 times this week alone just trying to >> You mentioned Amazon Prime. Yeah.
(01:43) >> Have you watched Fallout season 2? >> Not yet cuz I want to pay attention to that. >> It's very good. >> So what have I watched? I watched Lincoln Lawyer season 4 because I like Lincoln Lawyer and it came out like a week ago and I've watched all of the season. I watched Cross >> um cuz they started season two.
(02:01)  I didn't realize it wasn't all out. So I've done the thing where I've got halfway to the through the season and then gone I've got to wait now episode by episode which I hate doing. >> Yeah, same. >> And I have restarted. Oh, I watched the Diplomat. >> Oh, he's scraping the barrel >> which was okay.
(02:19)  And I started watching Homeland again. >> I quite like that >> cuz I got to the point where, spoilers, she's in like a It's not mental asylum, is it? It's like a she's been committed. >> Yeah, I know what you mean. Um >> I have seen it facility. >> It was a little while ago. >> So, and that story was dragging on for ages.
(02:38)  So, I got to that point, stopped, and then I've restarted from the start of that season again, and it sort of got a bit good again. >> I like Cla Dames. She's very good. She was in another season. suddenly became more interested there. His ears pricricked right up. >> Do you? >> Yeah. >> Ever since Yeah. Ever since Terminator 3. Okay. Yeah.
(02:57)  Was she in Terminator 3? >> She's in Terminator 3: Rise of the Machines. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. She plays Katherine Brewster. >> I haven't played seen that film. >> Yeah. You're not missing much. >> Um Well, we are obviously now the um the Amazon Prime box set podcast. >> Yeah. I mean, some of those are on Disney or >> other services are available.
(03:14)  Um, should we do should we do a little bit of hex? >> Let's do it. >> Run the thing. >> So, this is the segment where we talk about uh what we've been playing. Um, let's start with um Adrian. >> Oh, give me give me what you got. >> Fair enough. So, unfortunately, I was supposed to be playing games this weekend, but ended up canceling cuz not feeling great.
(03:42)  A >> so I was hoping to have other games to talk about and I don't. So I'm going to talk about Sanctuary instead, which is the perfect setup for how I feel about the game. >> I can tell by looking at your face that you are you you're feeling all the positive vibes about this Ark Nova clone. >> So I was Yeah, I was looking forward to Sanctuary.
(04:01)  The idea of a a lighter, more accessible, quicker version of Ark Nova seemed like a good idea. and the actions you do. Basically, what you're doing is you're building a zoo using your little tiles, similar to Arknova, except for the fact that each of the tiles has the symbology and what you're trying to do on each tile as you place it in the zoo.
(04:19) Now, it's got the four cards at the bottom like Ark Nova has that you kind of pick one card, you then move it to the left, and everything increases in power. The difference with this is is that one dictates basically your draft, what you can draft at the start of your turn. I'll talk about that in a second.
(04:38)  And then the other three cards are just play animals of different types. And the power goes 1 2 3 4. And when you upgrade them, it then goes 2 3 4 5. So as you play them from left to right, they're worth slightly more as you upgrade them. Um, and all you're going to do is on the start of your turn, there's like a river of cards.
(04:58)  Um, and depending upon where the purple card that allows you to play projects is, that will dictate how far up the the sort of the draft you can pick. So, if it's on the one spot, you can only take the first hex. If it's on the second spot, you can only take the second hex, unless you upgrade it, in which case you can take further up. Um, and so on.
(05:16)  And so you'll take it at the start of your turn, you'll see where your kind of uh the purple card is sat in your in your row of cards, and you'll take a hex from the draftable lot that's below that, equal to or below that number, and you'll add it to your um hand of hex's basically. And you're allowed, I think it's six at the end of turn.
(05:39)  You'll have to discard down. And then on your turn, you can do two things. The first thing you do is you take one of the action cards and you either play an um a project or you play an animal that is kind of that value or lower depending upon where your card is out of those four cards. And then you move it to the left and up.
(06:01)  And basically there's a there's like grass, water, and rock type Pokémon, sorry, uh animals. And you are basically like if the animal you want is a grass type then you'll use the grass card to play it into your zoo and it has to be either near the entrance or adjacent to one of the other um hex's. What you can then additionally do is you can play a building for free kind of thing.
(06:30)  Once you've placed once you've played your action card, you can then place a building for free or you can uh take an achievement. So, at the start of the game, you'll shuffle a load of uh little tokens up and it'll tell you um kind of it'll have like oh European animals or um birds or something like that.
(06:49)  It's a combination of either the location or the type of animal it is, you shuffle them all up and then you deal five out. And when you've got say you've got a two, three, four, and a five achievement that will worth different points. And if you have three birds, you can play your three achievement under the bird column kind of thing.
(07:09)  And then that is kind of each round. There's a few other things in there. So there's things like adjacency. So every hex you place in there, most hexes you place in there has scoring opportunities. So it's you know all adjacent um lizards or something like that are worth a point each or anything connected that's all comes from Africa for instance are worth a point each and that is pretty much the entire game.
(07:34) There's not really many extra rules. There are a few others but nothing really crazy in there. Um and it's really boring >> after all that. It's really boring. Tell me why. >> Because that's all you do. So you draft there is there is an ability to draft more stuff. Uh instead of playing a card, you can use that card in order to draw blindly from the big stack of hex's.
(08:00) But there's no there's a very small bit of engine building on some of the cards. But it is just it's about an hour it takes. And it is just draw one or two hex's on your turn or draw a hex and play a hex on your turn. and then occasionally acclaim these achievements. It says in the rule book for your first game, do not play with these achievements that I don't it would be a lot of doing nothing if it wasn't for those achievements cuz they really do make sure that you say you've got it's either five or six different
(08:30) achievements that you can go after. >> And it really does kind of funnel you to go after certain animals or to sort of build a certain way. Otherwise, it's kind of a bit of a free-for-all, which is probably good for if you've got people who aren't board gamers. But honestly, halfway through, both players playing it that were checked out completely, like were not bothered by the game at all.
(08:54)  And I've talked to a few friends and they were the same. They were just like there was nothing. 2 minutes into the game, we'd seen everything it had to offer. >> Wow. >> And and kind of that was it. It's It's such a shame because I do like Ark Nova. the the four cards at the bottom like Ark Nova where you're moving them around cuz three of them basically do the same thing with different types of animals.
(09:14) They're not really adding anything. >> No, it just seems to be like we're going to put this in cuz it's like the original but doesn't really do anything extra. >> And the as say there's a light bit of engine building where some of them are like, well, every connected African card you play allows you to blind draw something or to recycle something like draw a draw a hex and put a hex back or different things like that.
(09:37)  But other than that, that is really it. And you're doing that for an hour. Every turn, you are just drawing a hex off the draft and then playing a hex into the board. And it didn't feel like there was enough in the game at all to keep me going for an hour if I'm honest. >> Sounds to me like a tile conveyor belt.
(09:53) >> Yeah, it the thing is right is I kind of got to the end of it and I was like, what was what was really missing? I couldn't quite put my finger on it. All I could think of was that there's at least seven or eight other games that I could recommend to someone over it. You want to play this, you could play Cascadia, you could play harmonies, you could play Spectacular, Suburbia, Quadropolis, 10B would even be sort of have more to it and play in a quicker time.
(10:20)  If you want a quick game that's easy to teach, you show them Project L or Canvas or Azul or any of those and they would either play quicker or without with very little extra teaching, they would deliver a slightly deeper experience >> like because there's a few iconographies in there, you kind of have to teach the iconography.
(10:39)  So, it's a bit front-loaded. Every time a new animal turns up, you kind of have to teach it. And yeah, it's just goes on too long for the puzzle that isn't there. >> Well, there we are. >> Sorry. >> There we are. Sanctuary. There we are. Beex, what have you been up to? >> So, I played a copy of Koi by DV Games. Um, played it from like a a library at an event we've been to and then immediately bought it.
(11:05)  As is my >> Yeah. >> As is your style >> like you did with Project L. >> Like I did with Project L. Yeah. I think I'd bought that after the first turn, hadn't I? >> Yeah. Hey, we'll be playing it together and then like one turn one and you bought it. >> Yeah. Well, I was getting 20% off so I thought you got to do it. >> No brainer.
(11:18) >> So, Koi is a tile laying uh pond building game. Basically, you've got koiish as the name would suggest and you are trying to make the nicest environment for your koi to to score bigger points. So, you've got a sort of river of cards on one side, which is the I think it's called the meditate action where you choose which card you're going to have.
(11:46)  So, when you choose a card, you get the thing that the card says, which might be an immediate thing like an extra tile or a fish or whatever, and you get the thing that's underneath the card. And when you pick your card, all the cards shift up. So, you've got varying different kind of um rewards and the card. So you can use some of your cards kind of become a bit of an engine building kind of a thing.
(12:11)  So if you choose not to go to the meditation area and get a card, you do your working kind of um action which might be lay a fish. Lay an extra bit of pond. >> I love to lay a fish. >> Lay that fish. >> I love to lay a fish. >> And the beautiful thing is with this the koiish are on like clear acetate. >> I've just had a look on BG.
(12:32)  I got my iPad here. Um, and it's really pretty. It looks lovely, doesn't it? I'm a sucker for a pretty >> You start off with like, it's all hex's, which is why it's nice. You start off with, I think it's a three and a two, like the size five Arc Nova pens. So, like a three hex and a two hex underneath it.
(12:50)  And then you do certain things to get more pond or um what's it called? Uh when it's got leaves on it, like a verdant tree. No, no. There there is trees involved actually. Well, there's there's >> like bridges as well. Bridges and things. >> Your basic. Yeah. Like like a a fertile bit of pond. Yeah. And then the next turn if you've got a fertile bit of pond and you do the work action, you can put a little lily pad like a little lotus flower on that bit of pond.
(13:18)  So you're basically you're scoring points with how many fish you've got in. But also if the fish have got say water all the way around them, you score double with them. So this it's kind of like a a chaining kind of a thing. So on your work action, you can do one thing. You could either upgrade a thing, lay a fish, that sort of thing.
(13:35)  But if you've picked out certain cards from the market, you can then do the action on that. So you can chain them nicely. So your work action might be make a bit of your pond fertile. And then you might have the card that you've picked from the market that says if you've got a fertile bit of pond, put a lily, not a lily, a lotus blossom on it.
(13:53)  And then the next card you might have had, if you've got another thing, you can do another. So, you're trying to make like a chain, but you're also trying to make a really beautiful fish pond. Um, there's things that you put around it like Buddha statues or lanterns that make things in front of it. So, it is a bit like tile adjacency.
(14:11)  If you've got fish in front of the Buddha statue, you get an extra four VP 8. We can't remember what it is, but an amount of VP. >> What is funny is that, you know, on BG, you've got that button that says fans also like, and it shows you other games that maybe like that game. Didn't know that but an existed god. >> Yeah.
(14:28)  Yeah. So on on every on every game page is it's about halfway down there's a button and it will show you similar games to the one that you're describing. Uh and um Sanctuary is really Yeah. Which is really funny. >> It doesn't sound anything like Sanctuary. >> No. I remember looking at Sanctuary's other games you might like and there's a load of games I do actually like that say they're like Sanctuary, but I found Sanctuary not the same.
(14:51)  It sounds similar because it's about hex's which I mean so many games are. So that's not an exactly a and you've only got two different things you do. You either meditate and get cards from the >> from the thing which might mean you can also buy a fish from the fish market or you work which is basically do up your pond.
(15:06) >> Yeah. >> And you keep I can't think what the end scoring is. I think maybe when you run out of fish or >> Yeah. I can't remember. It's really pretty. >> It's quite a quick game to play and >> 45 minutes they say. >> Yeah. Something like that. I think probably we maybe played it about an hour, but that's because um two of us had never played before and one person had only played once.
(15:26)  So, we were not having to look at much stuff in the rules cuz it is very I would say very obvious. >> Everything you're saying about this game is like what I know about you is like this is like ticking every single box. >> It's it's it was I could tell as soon as we took it out of the box like, "Yeah, I'm going to like this.
(15:41)  I just knew I would." And it really does hold up. But there's enough in it if you get the right cards and get the right combos going. It's very satisfying when you can do that one thing which leads to this which leads to this which leads to this and that's really really a nice sort of satisfying feeling.
(15:56)  So you might have chaining sort of work objectives or you might have uh I don't know um sometimes you're going to get more VPs for every card that's got a picture of a well on it for example. So you don't have to kind of try and do these combo things. You can just look for what you've got lots of that that sort of thing.
(16:12)  There's there's lots of ways of getting points. Yeah, it's just very be it's a beautiful beautiful artwork. Um sing simple enough but a bit more of a bite to get your teeth into if you want to. So would recommend. And it was about I want to say it's about 40 quid >> 35 quid. So it's not I looked it up when you first put it on when you showed pictures of playing it.
(16:34)  I was like I need to have a look at this game and see what's about. But I know you own it. So >> yeah. No, we'll have to get a gaming. It's a It's a simple game. It's I don't know. I think um BG put it at 2 point something 2.07. So yeah, it is light. >> That's a two or three games a night. >> Stretch it medium.
(16:53)  But yes, you could easily play a couple of games of this or this and something else definitely. But yeah, really pretty satisfying I would say. >> Fish. >> Yeah. Fish aside, fish, >> it's still pretty and satisfying. >> Nice. So currently, what about you? What have you been up to? Um yeah, so I've been playing um a few different games, but I'm going to talk about um FOD, which is uh a game that I played with Mark Monk, who's uh reviewing a copy, I believe, for Paul Grogan um from Gaming Rules. Um yeah, really, really fun game.
(17:24) It's like a set in Norwe uh Norway, um based loosely around the the Vikings. Um and it's kind of area control and action car playing. Um, but it's got loads of um interesting nuances with it where you can build boats and that helps you get around and you can exploit the land by knocking down trees, removing them, they get, you know, so there's lots of different things you can do.
(17:50)  You can build churches, you can build um, yeah, various various different things, trading locations, and you can rescue your heirs. Um, and that gives you special powers and yeah, there's there it's a really interesting game that isn't too gotcha and kind of contentious, but with enough in it to make it an interesting two-player.
(18:13) >> So meaty, but not too backstabbing. >> Yeah, that's exactly right. Um, but yeah, I I found it a really interesting puzzle because you've got to it's kind of one of those games where you play action cards until you want to return them all. So you and you've got you can there's ways of getting extra action cards, but they're only one-offs, but then they form part of your VP condition.
(18:31)  So it's kind of like you want to do maybe a worse action that gives you a better VP ending. So it's just quite an interesting um quite an interesting game and I thoroughly enjoyed it. But I think I managed to tweak M, but that was cuz I I basically destroyed all of his boats and built loads more. So my maneuverability outdid his in the end. So um but yeah.
(18:48)  Yeah, it's really fun game. Um, I'd recommend it for anyone who likes um well the theme I suppose being a Viking style game and also likes an area control game without being too sort of screw you stab you in the back type type games like you know Game of Thrones or something like that.
(19:04)  Also played really well at two which I thought was quite unusual for an area control game as well. Normally you want three or four, don't you? But um >> is it up to four or is it just two players? >> I believe so. Yeah, I believe um I've just >> Yeah, it says four. One to four. >> Nice. >> Yeah, one to four. Um but yeah, I found it quite an interesting puzzle and kind of you know um some midway through the game Mark was kind of taking over.
(19:25)  I was like, "Oh no, I'm gonna lose this." Like, you know, I can't I can't lose this. And then um just one little swing like that says a lot about my back. We're going to talk about that. I must destroy him in the in the theme for the episode. I've got a bit about that. Um but yeah, I was like, I can't lose this. And then uh it's just one little swinging battle just tipped it totally the other way.
(19:44)  And then I started to, you know, it just snowballs and I just thought it's um yeah, there's a lot in there for quite a small game. Um and it only took us a couple of hours to get through the whole thing, but it felt quite chainy, quite satisfying, building towards something. And I quite like the playing action cards out of your hand where you've got one strong thing and one um less strong thing and you've kind of got to work out whether it's better to go for like the instant kind of better action or the thing that's going to benefit you more long term. I thought
(20:12) they did that quite well in it. Um, and then I always like games where you kind of got to decide when to take the cards back to your hand. A little bit like Concordia, not like Concordia, but like in that aspect. >> Yeah, even like Sentry and stuff like that has got that mechanism in it where you're trying to make the most of your hand and then >> obsession.
(20:29) Yeah. Being as efficient as possible and then knowing when to go, "No, I'm done. I need to get my cards back to make it more efficient." So, yeah, a really interesting game. I've not really played many games like that. it helped that he had the deluxe version as well. So, it was quite nice to have all the proper plastic and like you know the proper really good components and um but yeah, I'd recommend anyone giving a go.
(20:48)  I think it's either kickstarted or it's been recently like you know I'm not you know plugging it or anything really. I just quite enjoyed my my my play of it. So, if it is still available, you might want to have a little look if you're into that style of game. >> Nice. >> And you said um so the cards were multi-purpose.
(21:04)  So you could either play them as a one-off and get VP or play them down and get a longerterm effect. Was that the >> Yeah. So basically uh that that was more So you've got four I think it's four generic action cards and they're more like do this thing, do that thing, and it's both instantaneous and they're both different strengths depending on what you're doing, but it's more the fact of whenever you get one of your heirs, which is gained by going around the places and going to the castles.
(21:27)  Um, whenever you claim one of your heirs, you get to um, basically, not draft, you get to draw from the deck two different bonus cards. >> Okay? >> And then you get to choose which one you want to keep. Now, that is where you've got your choice where you've got like different colors and different ways. So, like if you take a red one, your red income gets a little bit better, but then it might, you know, gain you more VPs at the end of the game, but then the action might be a bit worse than what you want. So, that so those but they're
(21:51) one-offs, so you play them as quite good cards and then they go into your VP engine at the end of the game. So it's more those the basic action cards are kind of like a little bit like you know they help you either go up hills or go on a you know a long stretch of land like even bit of grand better. So there's just like different purposes from but the one-offs there that that's where it kind of you're trying to balance between the two different things you want and I like that element to it.
(22:13) >> Yeah it sounds sounds like there's good decision- making space in it. >> Yeah. Yeah definitely for for what is quite it's not it's not an easy game. It wasn't like um I would say you probably put it around 3.5 something like that. Um, but it and it played pretty quick, but it felt like there was more to it.
(22:30) >> Yeah. >> Yeah, >> that's good. That's a good combo, right? >> Yeah. As long as you like area control games, which I know you're not the biggest fan of. >> No, but like I liked Rurick. >> Yeah, >> I like that. Um, and I I don't mind the odd one, but they have to be a certain type or do a certain thing.
(22:46)  But yeah, it's got me intrigued as well. >> Yeah, I think I think it play it sat in its corner. Well, put it that way. >> Yeah. Good. Nice. >> What have you been up to there, mate? I've been playing Twilight Imperium for um with um with Curington as well. Um and um we incorporated the brand new Thunder's Edge expansion, which I've been dying to play since.
(23:05)  I've had it on the shelf since I think it was November when it was delivered. Um Thund's Edge um I mean I we could talk about TI4 forever, but I mean like you know if you don't know what Twilight Imperium 4 is and you've been listening to this podcast, where have you been? Um but TI4 has been around since 2017. It's basically a space opera game in a box.
(23:24) Uh Thunder's Edge adds um additional new mechanics like all TI4 expansions do. Uh Thunder's Edge uh specifically is a planet that comes into play after people have contributed to an expedition. Uh when people contribute to an expedition, they get a breakthrough card which gives them synergy for their technologies, which basically means that two technologies become one. Um as it were.
(23:48) So, if you've got red and yellow, then red, if you need a yellow one, um you can use a red one and vice versa. But once you've got the breakthrough, you have to roll a dieice. Um anyone who rolls a one or a 10, then um the fracture comes into play. And the fracture is an an additional three uh boards that come on the side of the of the systems.
(24:07)  It doesn't make them adjacent, but it basically gives you like a like an epic new part of the galaxy that you can go to. um where every planet there uh gives you a relic which which are really powerful in the main game anyway. Um but you can go to these planets and gain relics and they give you extra special powers because they're also legendary planets.
(24:26)  Uh basically it's it's an awesome high risk high reward area that the game gives you. Um with that with um all expansions of TI you're going to expect more factions and there are more factions which we got to play with, didn't we, Curly? Well, >> you didn't. Some of us did. >> You didn't.
(24:43)  Um but uh the rest of the players did. Um you went good old Muat, didn't you? >> Yes, I did. Yeah. No, the the factions that you drew me, thanks at >> um looked like a load of rubbish, including the only bad new faction. Um yeah, I I read all their rules and it just seemed like it was way too not too complicated for me to understand cuz I played TI lows, but way too fiddly, I would say, would be my >> the fact that you go you you're changing faction mat and changing all components kind of halfway through.
(25:10) >> Exactly. Yeah. It just it just seemed a bit too fiddly for me and and without putting too fine on a point on it cuz I don't um put all everything on it, but the internet was just absolutely bitching about that faction being my father. >> I didn't know that before. >> Oh, this sound horrendous.
(25:25)  I didn't like the look of it too. And then and then to have everyone else's opinion say not only too fiddly, but they just don't work. Um I was like, "Yeah, I'm not going to waste my uh my weekend. Thanks. So, I'm going to play a different faction." So, >> we took about seven seven and a half hours I think to play. >> Yeah, 7 and a half hours.
(25:41)  But it was a pretty chill start to be fair. >> Yeah. Yeah, it started pretty chill and then it started to ramp up once we kind of got kind of halfway down the scoreboard. Um, but what I liked about the game the most is that all five of us, cuz we're playing a five player game that all five of us were kind of in contention throughout the whole game.
(25:57) Well, not the whole game, but definitely. Um, well, I was in the lead for probably the first twothirds of the game, but then that happens in every TI game I play because I always get off to a really good start and then it just fizzles out. >> I'm just wondering why you didn't get wiped out about it. >> You did me a solid, didn't you? Yeah, that's what you want.
(26:17)  That's what you want me to talk about. You saved my little butt bot by uh dropping your supernova ability from Mua and and killing uh someone else on the boards uh pretty much a whole fleet >> um until they were down to not much. But they managed to rebuild up pretty quick. Um but it did it did you did do me a solid so for that. Thank you.
(26:37) >> And and I gifted you Warsons as well. >> You did. You did. >> It was your birthday. So >> it was Yeah, it was my birthday birthday game. Um, and I had I got the War Sons on the board, but I didn't actually use them. But they were a good deterrent. They were a good deterrent. >> Um, but we had good fun, didn't we? I had a great time.
(26:54) >> Yours sounded like you had lots of fun. >> Yeah, it was it was good. Um, I mean, we I I only play Twilight Imperium once or twice a year. Um, and I never really kind of put it in a top top 10 list because it is it's kind of that special game, but I do love playing and it takes forever, but I do love it.
(27:12)  It's in my gaming regrets as well, so I'm going to talk about that later, >> I think. Yeah, mine is as well, actually. So, so it's in mine as well. So, it be interesting to know what yours is and mine is. >> Um, but yeah, TI4, if you've not played it, what are you doing? Just give it you got to give it.
(27:26)  You need to give it a go at least once. It's not for you. It isn't for you. >> And it's 8 hours long. >> Yeah, it isn't for you. But I but I think if you are if you like the theme and you like area control and you like really kind of heavy games, then it's it's one to try at least once. I mean the the BGG difficulty rating on it now is now 4.44. Wow.
(27:47) >> With that added expansion and I think that's probably the highest I think I've ever played. >> But then we it's difficult for us to gauge it because actually we've been we've been dripfed the complexity. Oh yeah. over the course of the original, like we played TI3 ever so briefly, like once or twice. >> I played it a lot.
(28:04) >> And then um then TI4 came out, but then we've had the expansions little by little by little. Um so yeah, I don't think it's as difficult for us. >> I think that first expansion added enough to kind of take it to the high 3s, early fours at least. So I can imagine if >> if you're adding this in on top of it, I don't know if you're supposed to or not, but >> you you can.
(28:30)  And I I mean I'm I' I've been playing TI for so long. But if I was sat at the table Yeah. >> and someone gave me the game as it was and didn't tell me as it was an expansion, but just added it in anyway, I think I'd just be overwhelmed anyway because there's just so much going on. And it it is the sort of game that kind of teaches you like you need to learn how to walk again. Yeah.
(28:47) >> Because there's so much going on. So, but even if you if you didn't have those extra elements in there, would it make a difference? No. >> No. Well, again, it's it's basically £300 a game if you have the base and the two expansions. >> Yeah. >> So, the likelihood is if a brand new gaming group is trying it for the first time, >> they probably just bought the first one or some or some they're borrowing someone's copy and therefore if they're all new around the table, likelihood is someone would just show them the base
(29:12) alone anyway, wouldn't they? >> In fairness, I think the expansions add a lot, but I wouldn't bother buying it if I was new to the game. I just play the base game offers so much. >> I agree. Yeah, I agree with that. But it's only really for when you've played the base game a lot and you just want a little bit more variety.
(29:26) >> Yeah. Yeah, I'd agree with certainly for the first expansion. I'd agree with that. Great game to you. I love it. Should we uh should we go on to the main event? >> Yeah, we'll have to at some point. >> Let's do it. >> Okay, so today we are talking about gaming regrets. The confessional booth of the tabletop world.
(29:50)  We look back at the games we sold too soon, back too late, taught badly, ruled wrong, or defended for longer than we should have. Expect some questionable decisions here, emotional damage, and at least one host realizing that they were the problem all along. Um, I've got a list of gaming regrets here.
(30:10)  Um, I don't know how many you've got, but I've got quite a few. But I thought we would loosely go around the table starting with someone and going clockwise. There doesn't have to be an agenda. There doesn't have to be a subject. We can just go around and keep going. Um I can do regrets all day. Me and Adrian, we've been in this hobby a long time. We've got a lot.
(30:30)  Um speaking of which, Adrian, let's start with you. >> Oh, start with me. All right. Okay. Well, one of my gaming regrets is uh showing people new games. >> I wonder what you're going to say then for a minute. >> Or just generally >> showing my >> Not not generally. The the specifics I was going to go into here is when you show someone a new game cuz you think it'll all like it and then during the playthrough I realize I don't like it and everyone else has fallen in love with it and now that's all they want to play or I've already played it a lot and I
(31:05) show it to people and they go this is great and I think ah yes. So, so two examples. The first two examples that really come to mind are Far Away, which I've now shown. I think I've taught this game at least 30 times. I'm going to guess I've played it 50, 60, 70 times in person. >> That's a lot. >> Because I really enjoyed it to start with and I thought it's doing something different, but it's easy to teach.
(31:27) You're going to play it a couple of times probably. Great. Let's And then people are going to kind of remember the rules, so we'll come back to it. And for the first three or four months of that game, I was absolutely in love with it and had to show it to everyone. Like what is it two years later and I am so done.
(31:48)  But certain people when they turn up and like let's play a game and I'm like great. We've got all of these and they're like far away and I'm like >> yeah sure games 67 or 68 or whatever it'll be you know like let's just do that. And then the other one was um Architects of the West Kingdom. A friend was like, "What do I play? What do I buy? I want to buy a new game.
(32:08) " And I was like, "Well, you have lots of people around quite often." So, Architects of the West Kingdom is a euro game that you can play with. I think five and six, depending upon the expansions you've got and stuff like that. So, it's a bigger player count. It plays well at those bigger player counts.
(32:24)  I think people will enjoy it. And I already played it a couple of times at this point and I played like two more games and I was like, I don't like this game at all. But it was one of the few games they have that's like a Euro game and quite a few of my other group like it and therefore it comes out onto the table quite a lot and I just don't get on with it.
(32:45)  But I'm now forced to play it. So I regret showing those games. But there are a few others like that. But they're the two that always stick at the front of my mind where I'm just like I wish I hadn't shown you those. Generally I love showing people new games and because I normally have fallen in love with them first. I know that it's probably going to be all right, but far away because you can just play it quickly.
(33:05)  And I've now played it a bunch of times. >> Teaching you sleep. >> Yeah. And it's just And it's a quick game, so you can play two, three, four games back to back. And now people request it all the time. I'm like, there's a similar game that's like it like this. >> And they're like, "No, yeah, no. I want to play Far Away again.
(33:20) " And you're like, "Oh, please." >> No. >> Um, and then as say just occasionally I play a game, I suggest games cuz they fulfill a criteria, not because I'm in love with them. And then quite often we play them a few times and I'm like, I'm done. But they still want to keep investing, which is fair enough. I'll play it. It's not a problem.
(33:36)  But sometimes I do regret that choice. >> Nice. >> Beexs, hit me. >> Well, um, one regret I look back on is that absolutely god awful teach of Flamecraft on. >> Oh my god. >> What time of day was it? >> It was like 3:00 in the morning or something. >> You are forgiven. It was 3:00 a.m. There there are mitigating circumstances, but I'd forgotten that I'd even written myself a script of how to teach this game.
(34:06)  And I'm really glad I did because if I hadn't have written that, I would have just where I just would have been speech just out of my com. It's a really simple game. Like >> super simple. >> But anything at 3:00 a.m. >> Sure. But I used to do night shifts. I was I going all day >> vaguely. Yeah. But it was still terrible. and it was broadcast.
(34:27)  It's out there. People want to watch it and go Christ alive. She's terrible. Please, please go ahead and watch this. Watch this um teach and play through. But dear God, it was awful. >> I forgot. I I again, my memor is always a bit hazy on these things. But and especially of that day because I'm, you know, I was running the thing.
(34:47)  So, my mind is divided. But I I remember popping up and I see seeing you in there on a couple times and and I think I could see into your soul. >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean, bearing in mind that showing people how to do things is part of my job. I did not do a good job of showing people how to do things with this.
(35:05)  I mean, I know showing people how to do things at work does not normally inel like dragons and things. That isn't part of my day. Yeah, that'd be pretty cool. Um, >> so yeah, if anybody wants to watch this um horrific teach, >> it's on the internet. It's on the internet. >> It was so bad probably no one recorded it. >> No. Well, yeah.
(35:22)  No one have done a screen grab of it because it's just awful. It's so bad. And >> bless them. Everybody was was really good about it. Fortunately, they were all pretty good gamers. If I'd been teaching new people, they would not have had a good time because >> it was terrible. >> Just terrible. >> So that's Yeah.
(35:44)  Do I regret it? Would I go back in time and do something different? It was 3:00 in the morning. What else can you do? You know, >> but >> not agree to do it if that >> not agreed to do it in the first place. Probably wouldn't. >> Yeah, that probably would. Yeah. >> Or play a game, teach a game that I've played more than once, probably.
(35:57)  So, it was a bit more sort of muscle memory. >> Yeah. >> So, maybe that's a far away. >> Well, I've played that one time. I don't need to try and teach that, but I just get agent to do it cuz apparently he really likes Far. Um, yeah. So, maybe I should have played it more to prepare myself. So, that is a lesson for next time.
(36:15)  But I've taught other games I've only played once and that's been okay. But it wasn't at 3 in the morning. >> No. >> So yes, that is something I have learned. >> Rest assured that the 24-hour board game marathon for now is asleep. >> Curly, give us a gaming regret. >> Just one >> to start with. You have many. >> Yeah, I've got lots.
(36:33) >> Who knows? >> Yeah, I had a little think about it and I've got absolutely tons. So, okay. So, I'll limit it down. Um, I've got one big subject for Kickstarter, by the way. >> Kickstarter's on my list as well. I specifically Yeah, we'll we'll talk about that, I guess, as a group. But, um, okay. So, we'll start off with one.
(36:50) Um, my my ones fit into two generic categories. Okay. It's games that I've bought and backed and all that kind of stint. And there's also um behavior. >> Yeah. >> Right. Generally, so I'm going to talk about behavior cuz it's a funny one. I regret having a near tantrum at the start of a TR game once because I got a bad draw of planets.
(37:10) >> Was that Was that Was that last week? >> No, it wasn't last week. No. Jesus. that because you were all right. You say you were fine. >> No, no, that was low level. I think it was just the um the prospect. I'll tell you what it was. And I This is not to forgive it because I I wasn't I wasn't really bad, but I was salty for sure.
(37:26)  Um >> I love how you identify that you were. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't it wasn't my finest moment. Um, it was just the prospect of sitting down for 5 to 6 hours with the worst planet draft I've ever seen in my life and and the worst layout of planets around your home system >> in TI.
(37:48)  So like literally I I literally had no chance from the start. And that was just the the thought of having to sit there for the next five to six hours knowing that luck other people making [ __ ] stupid decisions >> to screw me over rather than benefit themselves. It really pissed me off at the time and I'm angry thinking, "No, I'm not really.
(38:10) " Um, but no, so probably um not that I'm surprised I reacted that way, but more that I do regret that. >> Do you know how many planets you had like around your media system? I mean it was like two or three. >> Two or three. >> Okay. >> Like that sort of level and then none outside of that. >> Yeah. >> So that was my first ever game of TI.
(38:28) >> Yeah. >> Was I was the Chaka >> who don't like to move much anyway. And they literally got two planets and then a whole void of space and loads of asteroids and stuff. >> Yeah. Yeah. That that was exactly what >> And it was just like, well, what am I going to do for the rest of this game? >> Yeah. >> So I can I can fully appreciate that cuz I sat there going, "Oh, I'm really excited to play this for the first time.
(38:48) " time and then just sat there going, "What am I going to do?" Like within 20 minutes, like what am I going to do? >> That's a good gaming regret though. >> Yeah. Just to summarize. >> Yeah. Salty man. >> Yeah. I mean, we in fairness, I don't know many people who haven't had a salty moment similar to that. I think JP had one for TI.
(39:05)  Like Martin Blessing, Martin Ward had a um had a one on Civilization New Dawn. Um there you go. That's one of my many gaming regrets. >> Done. That's one of yours then. um purchasing the wingspan nesting box. >> A but it's so beautiful. Don't get me wrong there. But this is exactly it, right? >> It stops it from being taken anywhere else outside your house, doesn't it? >> And that's the reason why I get annoyed with it.
(39:32)  So Wingspan I I'm that invested although I haven't bought the new expansion yet. >> When is it out? >> Um retail drop is like next month I think. Okay. Um, but the obly if you went through Stone M or you're Stone Champion, then you would have got it already. Um, I did have that subscription, but I I cancelled it. Um, when I place an order for it, I'll probably get that and I'll get a load of Rolling Realm ones I'm missing as well, but I just haven't got around to it yet.
(39:55) Um, but you can't get it. You can't get it out of the house. No, >> it's so big. It's bigger than than Anacron's big box. It's massive. Um, and because of that reason, like my wife doesn't play too many games anymore, but Wingspan is one that she likes to play, but as a two-player game, to try and get that downstairs and then out and then unpack it all from the box and set it all up for just an hour's game is a pain in the neck.
(40:24)  There is no, they almost should have done like they did with Rolling Realms and include a travel box. Now, I know a travel box for Rolling Realms is small because it's just a deck of cards and some pens, but if they had released something like that, and I always do give Stone My Games a bit of a bit of dirt when they release the box, which is empty and they charge 60 quid for it, but if they did release something that you could take Wingspan as a travel set, I would be kind of up for that.
(40:54)  Um, but I and also flock mode is awful. >> I've never done it. it just does not appear at all. >> And that is one of my regrets is wingspan nesting box and the and the flock mode that is contained within it. I have played flock mode um and I've taught it with new players playing flock mode and I will never ever do that again ever.
(41:15)  It just doesn't work and it's too fiddly and too too complicated for new players. Um, don't get me wrong, I love Wingspan and it's a great it's a great game and I like birds, but that nesting box unfortunately has tainted the experience for me now where I just don't get it to the table cuz I can't be asked. >> But it's so beautiful, so well designed, so well made, it it's it's basically it's a kind of product of its own beauty.
(41:40)  I can't think of the words, but you know what I mean? Like when something is so good, it ruins everything. It pisses all over the side box when they brought that out which came with some flimsy tuck boxes inside and everyone winged. And I think people they probably learned from that and went no let's do a proper >> quality quality beautiful and it was I got the first print run.
(41:58)  Uh and it's a great it's a great box. It's a great it's a great storage device for all the content. Nucleium needs something like that when they finally bring it out. Um, but Nucleium takes three hours to play and I can justify bringing that downstairs for a three-hour game for Wingspan. When we me and the wife, we used to play it a lot and we could get a game of Wingspan done in 45 minutes if not less.
(42:21) >> So to just play a game for 45 minutes, you you could easily say, "Oh, let's play a game." But doesn't normally happen in my household, unfortunately. It's a one and done. Um, so yeah, it is beautiful. Can't can't dispute that. But it doesn't get to my table because of that.
(42:35)  and I regret the purchase of it because of that reason cuz I just don't play the game as much anymore. Um, Adrian, back to you, my friend. >> So, one of my gaming regrets is um buying a game that somebody else in the group normally buys either shortly afterwards or exactly the same time, which means that my game sat sits unplayed on a shelf.
(42:59)  So, like the two two that again come to mind. So, I've backed Apex Legends. And then JP was like, I've backed Apex Legends. And then my Apex Legends has sat on a shelf and that's it. >> I bought it, too. And I sold it. >> Yeah. So, mine still sits there. >> But yeah, it was a bit like, okay. And then I bought Kamban as secondhand.
(43:19)  And then >> EV. Yeah. And then about two weeks later found out that JP had added it to his speak easy pledge. >> Did he? I didn't realize. So, and it's just arrived before I've put got mine to the table. So that will now just sit there doing nothing. >> It's JP's fault. You're in >> if you ever looked to sell it.
(43:36) >> Yeah. >> Let me know. >> Well, we did it with I think it was Weather Machine or something like that as well where I bought that and then someone else bought a copy of it and I've Game of like years and years ago I bought Game of Thrones. We popped it all out. Hadn't got it to the table. Next week found out that my friend had bought bought a copy and then we played that copy and my Game of Thrones game never got played.
(43:57)  Do >> you still have it? >> No, I sold it. Because in the end it turned out about six people I knew all had the Game of Thrones board game cuz it's quite popular. But >> I feel like I do it more than other people where they like I just buy a copy of a game and then it never gets played cuz other people buy it >> and it just sits on the shelf.
(44:17) >> I don't have that >> because I enjoy it. I don't want to sell it in case someone else sells it or something. So it just it just sits. >> I'm pretty good at like moving on games. But yeah, there's a few games that I've bought that then other people have bought. So my copy never gets played. It just sits on the shelf looking pretty.
(44:35) >> I've got a weird version of that where three of my three favorite games I don't own any of them. >> Yeah, >> because JP anacrony trarion. I was trying to think of my next it probably be TM. So TM's the only one. the only one I've got. But my top two I don't own and probably never will. >> I think JP's got he's got an acrony into cream but doesn't have TM.
(44:57) >> There's a common theme. It's just JP. JP owns the games you like. JP. Yeah. So, >> and is another And he also does the thing where if he likes a game, he buys it quite quickly quite often. So, even if you got a copy of it. Yeah. So, he'll just go out there and buy like buy a copy even though the group's got it.
(45:13)  So, quite often you then go, "Oh, okay. Well, we >> I understand that. >> We play 50% of our time at Jo's at least. So therefore, >> if I like the game, I want to own it because I want to own it on my terms. I want to play it on my terms. And I know that's how he feels about it, too. So, I totally understand that.
(45:27) >> I used to be like that a lot. And I when I before I met you guys and came to the pod, um my gaming group, I was the person that bought all the games because I had this weird ownership issue that I needed to have them. And >> is that is that where um sort of the big baby of board gaming came from? >> No, that's just you. That's just you.
(45:45) No, no. That no >> that mentality, not the name. >> I call you. I'm just wondering where that behavior came from that made me call you that. Was that part of it? >> No. The fact that I just like being yellow. >> Okay. To the point of a tantrum. Maybe that should be one of your regrets, having a tantrum over not getting yellow.
(46:01) >> That is a that is that is probably a regret that I have to pick yellow and I can't get out of picking yellow. Or if I can't have yellow, I'll have a different shade like tan or orange. And if I come back, it's red. >> I don't even like yellow. I'm only yellow because everybody else that I played the only person which was my reason for playing yellow as well was because no one else wanted to play it.
(46:20) So >> I it has to be yellow or nothing. >> And now and now half of our gaming group are used to playing yellow if I don't I don't mind not playing yellow but I just know I'm going to start moving the yellow pieces if I'm not yellow because I'm just so used to playing yellow. >> I'm the same unless it's something that's faction specific like again with TI then that's okay.
(46:40)  But if it's not, >> just >> I just remember that you you got the speaking of that that nickname I gave you, which is probably unfair by the way. Thanks. >> Um but the the reason why you got it is cuz I turned up to your house once and you'd given yourself the color. You you'd um given yourself the seat position and and wouldn't sort of um you know randomize it between everyone.
(47:00)  And you said you were going first. So I was like what? And then ever since then you've been the big >> like my late grandfather. That was his armchair. It was his ass groove in the seat. It was his remotes. It was his telly. That's how he was. And I'm when we play Mario Kart, I am player one. That's just how it how it goes.
(47:21) >> That's different to going first in every game you play. >> When we play when we play Super Mario Bros., you know, I I am Mario. >> Yeah, I was waiting for that. When we play any kind of video game that has Mario as a character in it, I will always be Mario. >> Basically, you are always Mario when you play those.
(47:39)  So, >> yeah. It's only cuz no one wants them cuz I like the evil guy. >> I'm I'm a born Becky won't have >> You're not a Slytherin. I won't have it. It's just not true. >> No, >> you might have got Slytherin like nuances, but you're a Gryffindor. You You're reluctant Gryffindor, but you're a Gryffindor.
(47:58)  It's just It's just how it is. I'm a war and we're going to win. >> Nice. Was that you wrapped up? >> Yeah, it turned into a bit of a rag on JP. It wasn't that. It was more just JP all our games. >> It was more just that I don't like buying games to find out someone else who bought it and we're probably going to play their version more than mine and therefore feel like I've I've wasted a purchase even though I do still want the game and it annoys me.
(48:24) >> I get that. Becky, give us another >> Well, it's a weird It's sort of a regret and it's sort of something I'm not going to change at all. >> So, how much >> she doesn't really regret? No. >> Well, I I do regret it, but it's just a part of my personality. It's just tough [ __ ] and that's how it is.
(48:40)  I wish I didn't have to go like all in to get the big version, the big shiny version. >> This is this is a good conversation starter this one >> because because I know it isn't necessary and >> it's not, but it's shiny. >> Yeah. But having all the various modules of something, if I like how the game is, what I actually don't want to do is change how the game works.
(49:04)  So sometimes adding a little module on the side is okay, but if it but if it changes the game massively, I'm not going to like it. Like I know sort of, you know, it's a bit of an autistic trait, I guess, but I'm my brain's set up to know that Cubas is how you play with the base cards. And I know you've got what how many more is there? Like five.
(49:23) >> Yeah. >> Of each different power. So you can have five different things that each card each color dice does. >> I don't want to play with the others cuz I know how the first ones work now. I don't want to learn the others. I don't want to do it. I don't want to know. >> Quacks and the recipe. >> I don't want my brain is geared up and this is how it is now.
(49:42) >> I get that with the with quacks as you mentioned quacks. I quite like the way that these work. So I'm not sure I want to change it. So, I feel like I'm not getting the most out of the game because there's all this variety. I don't want variety. I want >> I want clean cut. I want something I already know.
(50:02)  I don't want any horrible surprises. I want I know how it works. I don't want to change it and I like how it is, so leave it alone, please. So, getting all the kind of fancy I don't mind this the sexy components. I'm okay with that cuz that's always I'm always going to pick the shiny bits. >> Yeah. But when a game's got variety, I tell myself, "Oh, but this is great.
(50:21) It's got all this variety." I don't want variety. I want predictability. >> So just so just don't back the expansions. >> Yeah. But you can't I'm a completist. That's my trouble. So I've managed to get rid of Baron Park 2. The return of the Bad News Bears. >> I I did sell that and I never played it. I popped it out when I constructed the little towers.
(50:45)  I don't want it to change the game because yeah, Baron Park is Baron Park. I don't need it to do something different. I don't >> What What if someone teaches you the the intro version of a game of which you really like, you then buy a copy, notice that it was the intro version and the full version adds this extra mechanic. What would you do then? >> Well, that's interesting because basically that's that's my Septima journey.
(51:08) >> So, I first learned is that your regret? So you they tell you and I'm I'm I I am a rule follower sometimes, but the rules the book says do the base one first. So I did what I was told and did the base one first. But I think it doesn't the the alternative side of the map, the other version of the map doesn't change how things play.
(51:34)  It just adds another layer of it's like a sidebar. You've got another thing to do or not to do. >> Um so it doesn't change how it plays. However, if I'd have learned, say Cubas with the different cards, it doesn't have to be maybe the first version, but the version I learn first. So, if something changes it up, I need to learn that first.
(51:54)  Like, put all the stuff in together and that's how it is in my brain now. That's fine. Like terraforming Mars with the preludes and stuff >> because that's how it is in my brain now. I don't need to, you know, but that's why I bristled against marine worlds in ARN nova. It changes it. It's a whole new I don't know variant and I'm not interested.
(52:16)  My brain likes this variant and I don't want to change it. I Yeah, >> I understand it. Fair. Fair. Curly, give us another. >> Uh, okay. Well, I'll give you two for one. >> Nice. >> Cuz they're quite similar. I I'll just briefly gloss over one. I really regret kickstarting and trying to play Europa Universalis. Oh yeah, that box was oh my >> freaking such a big box.
(52:40) >> I looked at the um the the kind of the the AI element of what you do in what turn orders and stuff. I was like, nah, it's not for me. Like it's one of those where you open up the box and you start to read towards you're like, nah, no, this is too much for me. The complexity of that [ __ ] game. My god. >> We had it in the board game marathon as a raffle prize.
(52:58) >> Yeah, >> I was going to rig it so that you won it, >> mate. I'd have taken it. I'd have put it straight on eBay for like true. >> You did sell it pretty quickly for quite a good price as well. >> Oh yeah. Yeah. I sold it for a profit if anything. So it it wasn't a big regret like oh my god I'm saddled with this thing but my god attempting to buy it because you like the game.
(53:17)  You like a strategy game all this kind of stuff. It equaled I would like it but just the I mean there's some proper flipping guys made that. Jesus. It's the graphs and charts and >> yeah, it was just beyond my interest. But but it's and I'm not knocking people, but like it's more for those people who like playing like those big epic like military campaign war and and I'm not knocking it.
(53:39)  It's just more than I'm interested in, you know? I just like a more casual entry level to any strategy game. I want to be one and done 3 hours, four hours kind of thing. >> I'd like to see it and do it. I don't want to see I don't want to have to work out charts on and you know and you know stick a stick one of those visors on to try and work out you know there's >> account I think it got to a point where and people who have played it will understand this where I couldn't even properly declare war I needed to have a reason for it first so you've got to try
(54:05) and you know um >> have you played the PC game >> briefly yeah it's not I'm more of a civ guy personally >> um than European universalist but I had a brief stint into it and yeah it's just it's I just don't I think it's as much my sort of thing. So, I regret buying that on a whim really thinking I'm probably going to like this and I really didn't. Um, not that it's a bad game.
(54:28) It's gone down really well with the community, but um yeah, it's just too much for me or not too much, but way beyond my interest level. Um, but I'm going to put that with and this is slightly controversial um Frost Haven, similar sort of thing. So, with Frost Haven, I absolutely loved Gloom Haven, one of my favorite games.
(54:48)  cuz I I got to the point where I was playing two simultaneous campaigns with two different groups. Um so I love love Gloom Haven. Frost Haven way way too much in it. So the the extra phases in the town, upgrading the town, all that stuff. Not interested. >> Did you buy Frost Haven? >> Bought Frost Haven. Um the box was I mean it got to the point where it took nearly an hour to set up every time and and like 40 minutes to break down and at the time we weren't really leaving out cuz we were gaming in between.
(55:20)  So doing that hour and 40 minutes and then the scenario you'd spend sort of best part of 3/4 of an hour with your head in your book but working out what town actions you were going to take in between doing the actual n it check out at that point. So, >> you know that TRI took an hour and 45 minutes to say that when we were at yours the other day.
(55:37) >> Only cuz we were [ __ ] about. That's what I meant when I said a casual chill start because we should have done it a lot [ __ ] quicker than that. >> Oh god. Yeah. >> It's, you know, and even then TI is a little bit different cuz it's a big long sort of weekend style game. Frost is like to do one scenario is like, you know, two or three hours at tops.
(55:55)  You know, unless you sort of throw a few together, there's no point. It just takes too long. Um, but yeah, just not for me. I know some people love it and like the added complexity, but for me it went to a place that turned me off of it. >> Okay, my second one. Um, Mega Civ Mega Civilization buying it twice and selling it twice.
(56:23) This is this is my regret. So, I had >> How many times playing it? >> Once. Good question. Good question. >> I like that. >> No, actually that's a lie. That's a lie. Twice. Twice. It was twice. Um, but good question. Um, so when I first had Mega Civilization, when it first came out, um, I mean, Civilization has been around for a long long long time.
(56:46)  Um, but the Mega Civ version, um, is a 5 to 18 player board game. uh where the board if you're playing it at full player count is I mean this this table is a is a is a good size uh board gaming table that we're sat around right now but the the board is probably about three times as big as this table. >> Who's got the time space or >> crap? People who play mega games.
(57:07)  Yeah, I hired out a a pub uh function room to play this and I had 17 players. >> Um I I did it. We played it. four people decided that it was a good idea to cheat and that made me salty. So that was that's probably my biggest salting gaming moment is that when I found out that four people had cheated their way through >> blatantly or >> um not blatantly to me because I was running the game.
(57:37)  It was only that others had discovered and they were coming to me and telling me this is happening, this is happening on purpose. They hadn't >> Yeah, it was on Yes, it was on purpose. It was on purpose. Um, and in in the game you can get uh cal calamities which basically will ruin your civ. Um, and it could be like drought, famine, floods, it could be weird things.
(57:54)  Um, but you're trying to trade um these calamities with other people. So you're trading goods with other people in an open discussion open discussion time in the game that lasts for I don't know about 15 20 minutes. Um, and you all go around the table trying to trade as much resources you oh I got three cotton but I need another one or whatever.
(58:12)  But these calamities, you've got to try and tra you can trade some of them with other people, but some of them you can't trade. And some people were trading the ones you can't trade. Some people who know that they were actively losing would say, "Well, give me your one your calamities. I'll take them on and you just take the goods.
(58:26) " And you know, and kingmaking as well. Kingmaking I don't mind if you're doing that. So be it. But it was the blatant cheating. You change trading these cards and you're not allowed to do so. And also some people were hiding calamities actually from from plain view. And I discovered this at the end of the game. So this game took we started at like 10:00 in the morning and we were done by about 8:00 at night.
(58:46)  So it was a long time and I found out in the last kind of hour that these people were doing this and I I was very very very annoyed. >> Yeah. Understandable. >> Yeah. And it took it took it took me weeks of planning to get this game to the table. Um we played it that happened. I was very salty. Um I was so salty that I I sold the game.
(59:05)  So if I if I always have this kind of rule set where if ever game ever makes me really salty, I'll sell it. So this is not for me. It's making me angry. I'll sell it. So I sold the game. This game came in a wooden chest. >> Wow. >> Um have a look at it online if you get a chance. It is it is a a thing of it was a thing of beauty. Um so I sold it.
(59:23)  I regretted that I sold it probably after about a year of selling it because I knew that it was actually quite valuable. I did get what I paid for it, but I thought I should have kept it. Maybe I could have played it again. Then 999 Games who made it then decided to go, "Oh, we're going to make it again, but they're going to make it Eastern and Western Empires.
(59:39) " >> Yeah. >> So, they split the game into two, but then you can put the two together. >> And put them together. Yeah. >> Yeah. And make it Mega Empire. They called it Mega Civ, but they they changed the name. >> I bought both. >> Yep. >> Didn't play the game again and sold it again. >> Nice. >> And it cost me a fortune.
(59:56) >> To be fair, I'm feeling the same about the War Room. I've played the War Room. I've not played the global campaign of the War Room yet. >> Oh, I said War Machine. I meant war room. Yeah, war room. >> Um and yeah, War Machine is slightly different. Um but the War Room is is a game that I really want to play.
(1:00:11)  I can't foresee when I'll actually get to play it. >> I'd like to try it myself, >> but if I sell it, I'll end up buying it again in the future. So, it's kind of it's going to sit there probably not be ever played again, maybe. >> Have you played it at all? >> I have played the smaller scenarios, just not the global one.
(1:00:26) >> The global one. The big one. The big which is the kind of the main point to have it, right? So, >> yeah. So, I've kind of have a similar feeling of that is I imagine if I would sell that game, I would probably buy it back >> fairly quickly and because in my head I want to play it still. >> Yeah. So, let's do one more quick round.
(1:00:45) Um, quick fire. Give me regrets. Adrian, let's go. >> Uh, I have quite vocally previously said I don't think I've ever regretted selling a game. And yet, I now have an itch to buy a game back that I've sold before. So, normally I'm quite happy to sell games. All good. And I think I've actually sort of downplayed this game quite a bit because it has its faults, but man, I want Batman Gotham City Chronicles back.
(1:01:10) >> Always very bitty that game. >> Yeah, there's a load of symbology that they've now created little player aids for that wasn't in my version of the game. There was loads of rules where they were all identical, but they had like so ice you could walk on if you had like um like ice hooks or whatever, ice picks or whatever.
(1:01:32)  But that was exactly the same as another terrain feature that just simply had a different card to stop it. So rather than putting it all under one rule and saying these are the ones that stop it, it was all completely explained differently in the rule book as though they were completely different rules and yet they weren't.
(1:01:46)  And so it does have its problems and it took up it takes up with the expansions I had two Calax cubes >> which at the time I only had about eight or 10 to use and therefore it was taking up a lot of space and the timers on it are designed so that it's a puzzle. It's not really a dungeon crawler. It's it's a bit like Gloom Haven in the fact that it's more of a puzzle because you have to do things in exactly the right order otherwise you run out of time.
(1:02:12)  So, it has problems with it and yet keep having the itch to play it again and no one in the group owns it. Therefore, I'd have to buy it back cuz I think there is a a lovely side to it. >> It's gorgeous. It's a lovely the but just the game play, the way it plays is not like a lot of other games. There's a few bits and pieces out there in other games, but it's not quite the same as other sort of one v many.
(1:02:39)  It's not the same as an Imperial Assault or anything like that, which is one vy kind of games. And yet, there's something about it that I really want to get to the table again. And so, I kind of have now. At the time, I didn't regret it. And I haven't regretted it for probably two or three years, but now slightly wishing I still owned it.
(1:02:57) >> And so, small regret. >> Good one. That Yeah, it's a very pretty game. >> It's lovely. >> Nice. >> Yeah. Anyway, >> thanks. I think I think everybody that gets into gaming has had the same regret of when you very first get into it and you realize you love it, you just buy everything.
(1:03:16)  Or as so many different games that are just like the hotness or the really good classics or whatever and then you've got a whole bunch of games that you're probably going to play once or or twice and realize, oh, actually that's not the kind of game I like. Same. >> But you feel like you should like it. >> Same. >> Specifically, I'm going to say Spirit Bloody Island.
(1:03:35) Do you still own it? >> Yeah. >> When did you last get that to the table? >> Uh >> cuz you bought all the new bits like two UKs ago cuz I was there. >> Yeah. >> I I love it. >> This is I don't want to get rid of it because he really likes it. >> Um so there's no >> I think you like it. You just It just gives you a [ __ ] I don't like it.
(1:03:54) >> You did like it at the time. >> I don't like it. >> I I just don't like it. It I only I can only play the person with the speed. I've said this lots of times on the podcast, so this is boring, but >> I can only play that one character because it means I don't have to think about what the game state is going.
(1:04:08)  I don't like games like that. >> I just don't like it. >> But I wanted to like it and it looked all nice and all the rest of it. Oh, it's all kind of natury and yeah, cool. >> I don't like games like that. So, I wish I hadn't bought it. and other games, you know, when you first get into gaming, like I said, to start with, you know, you think, "Oh, I'm going to get all of these the the good ones that everyone's talking about, either brand new hotnesses or the classics, and you realize actually there's games that you
(1:04:34) prefer and there's games types that you don't like." >> I did that with UA when I first got a Gria, and you're talking a long time ago. Got a Gria like, "What else does Rosenberg offer?" And then it was just like I'm gonna have to get them all. Yeah. And I did. and then like they just didn't didn't play them or they sell them and they just it was just and I wouldn't do that now.
(1:04:56)  I don't I don't I I've just sold my copy of Feast for Odin cuz it just doesn't get to the table. So I I've kept a Gricola and I've got a Civera um patchwork doesn't really count but it is his. Um and that is kind of about it. I just don't but I had I had Laav I had all of them. >> It's almost Yeah, there's a bit of a completist element about it.
(1:05:16)  Oh, I like that design, so I want all of those things. Or I'm just getting into this, so I want to be able to follow the conversation that everyone's having about certain games and actually I should have just done a bit more research into games that I like or or maybe figured out a bit earlier, games that I like and games I just don't and just don't try and force the games you don't like.
(1:05:34) >> As you say though, I think all gamers go through that. Anyone who collects board games, they go through that exploration phase. And while you might regret the money spent on it, looking outside in, I really enjoy watching people explore their gaming space basically and kind of I'll try that.
(1:05:54)  No, that's not for me and I I'll give this a go and no, that's not for me. I love outwardly watching other people go through that experience because I think it's such a in any hobby quite often it's such a key experience that you go through that you you kind of join a hobby or it could be anything and you'll kind of go I'll try all these different things and >> hear no idea is basically >> yeah and basically I don't actually I don't like this okay if I I've learned that and then I I don't like this but I do love this so I'll buy more of these
(1:06:19) and I love watching people go through that >> if you don't have the impulsivity to to to just buy all the thing and then you realize what did I why did I spend that money? I should have I should have just bought lots of this type or or you know so that's yes it's a first world problem.
(1:06:37)  I I was fortunate enough to be able to well basically I bought loads of them in the in the bring and buy in the UK now pretty much. So if you didn't pair that with a reluctance to get rid of games, it's fine. >> When when you have got a reluctance to get rid of games and um you're kind of you've you're lucky enough to have a bit of space.
(1:06:57)  So space is not necessarily the kind of limiting factor. Yeah. It's I just wish I didn't go so >> Yeah. Yeah. Full in. I I think I've rather than it being a regret, I've kind of come to that kind of realization now that I don't need a collection of 200 plus games. >> This is it. >> Um and like you said, Adrian, about the exploration phase, >> I remember my own exploration phase and I remember just going I'm going to buy everything >> all of the games and and I' and I've and I've done that and I'm now on the other side of that now. It took a while, but
(1:07:29) I'm now on the other due to other factors other than kind of like knowing what I specifically want. also money. I couldn't afford it when I changed jobs. Um, but now I'm I I can now afford it again, but I just don't want to. >> You start thinking a collection rather than just scatter gunning just all the >> I've just sold about 30 games in the last um last month.
(1:07:51)  Um because I just need to shave that collection down. Now my collection is of more of a of a of a good size because I don't and I'm very selective now about what I buy because I just don't need to buy everything anymore. And I know what I like and I know what what gets to the table. But you don't get that unless you do the exploration phase.
(1:08:07) >> You have to do Yeah, you have to go through that phase. >> You have to build up that experience, don't you, to know designers or mechanics or, you know, just how to cut through the Kickstarter jargon and figure out what it is you want in a game. So, you're kind of watching videos going on BGG.
(1:08:24)  have to build up those skill sets and that knowledge in order to get to the point where you then can >> it's like going on Kickstarter and just going oh look is a game about this read the first three sentences. No >> y >> rather than go well I like the theme and for that reason alone I'll buy it or I like because it's about this IP so I'm going to buy it. No way.
(1:08:45)  Don't do that anymore. Used to do it all the time. >> Yep. Yeah. My first I think my first four Kickstarted board games all got sold within a year >> because they weren't right. I just oh look that's cool that's about the plague then like it's all cool artwork or whatever I'll buy it. Read one read of the rule book probably not going to play that.
(1:09:03)  So you know whereas now I know to have a look at the rule book or to to watch some videos or whatever it is to to make better choices. >> Absolutely. >> I've been really lucky when it comes to Kickstarters. So, I don't think I've really backed her bad game yet, which is a very fortuitous. >> Sorry, wasn't your last regret? Europa Universalist.
(1:09:19) >> Wait, wait, wait. Europa Universalist and Frosta for that m are excellent games. I They're just not my type of games, but I but I've been really I didn't do enough research into Well, there's a whole bloody bunch. I mean, I could look at these ones here, but there's there's a whole bunch that I didn't do any research into and totally lucked out. like Heroes of Mighty Magic.
(1:09:39) That was a real um L box one. Mosaic. Um there was Rurick I didn't really do much research into. I've got um there was Dwellings of Elder I bought and not many people backed that at the time as well. Um and it's turned into a bit of a big hit this time. So yeah, I've just been really lucky. >> Nice. Nice. >> Yeah.
(1:10:00) >> Your final regret? >> My final regret? Um, my final regret is against going by we're gonna have to rename this episode by the way into Twilight Imperium. >> Yeah, because it's Twilight. >> I know it's been a lot of TI chat. >> It's not It's not a long one this one. Um, >> have we done an episode of of TI just on TI? >> You have done obviously Mine Clash specifically.
(1:10:23)  We should maybe we should maybe I mean I will say that probably switch off about half the people who normally regularly listen. >> Maybe we need maybe it's an expansion pack. >> Yeah, maybe. Yeah, maybe. Um, yeah. So, my um regret is not playing a four player earlier. >> Yeah, >> I played six to eight players for the longest time and I nearly fell out of love with it actually.
(1:10:44) >> Took too long, too much contention, um too long between turns, all these different things. Yeah. Um and it just Hey, look, >> it was still cool. nice to do every now and again, but it felt like one of those things you were just there to have a good time with your friends, which is cool in and of itself.
(1:11:02)  But I think as a fourplayer game, it's so much tighter. It's so it feels so much more satisfying. You got a little bit more room to maneuver. You get two strategy cards. Your turns come around quicker and it doesn't really detract in any way, shape, or form. So, for me, it's just a better game at four player. and Eclipseed it for a little while >> and now four player has clawed its way back.
(1:11:26) >> I agree with a good 90% of what you're saying, >> but there is that little part of me that would like to play TI4 with eight >> and only do it once because I've never done it. I've done six unless never do a three. Never do a three-player TI. >> I love three >> three player TI. I'd never do a three player only because I find that if two two gang up on one >> and I'm not a big fan of that in any game doesn't matter if it's TI it's any game if it happens where there's three players and it's an area especially area
(1:11:57) control where two can gang up on one not >> that's what happened to me cuz you didn't do anything so it's three against one >> yeah but it wasn't but it was a four player counts you know >> was wrong wrong player count but I would like to do an eight just to say I've done it just the once and everyone needs to know what they're doing.
(1:12:16)  I know you'd be out. I know you'd be up for that. >> Yeah, I was going to say as long as you don't count me in that. >> Yeah, but that now I would I would find that hard to find eight players who know, including myself, that would know what they're doing. Who would be up for it? But four player all day long. Yes, absolutely.
(1:12:30) >> Adrian's up for it. >> No. >> When was the last time you played TI? >> Uh whenever the last expansion came out. >> Not the one just gone. >> Not the one just gone. Yeah, >> the one before that. >> And um was my last I'd given it at this point. I think it was three or four times I'd gone gore and then I'll give it another go and was just at the end of age one I was like this just isn't it's not for me.
(1:12:56)  But it was the it was again it was where loads of people I wouldn't see often would turn up like an old friend group would turn up and play a game. So I played it just to say to to see them. >> Yeah. >> And then was like I hate not that I hate but really dislike hate too strong a word but really dislike playing this game.
(1:13:15)  um to the point where I said to them, "Next time, let's play Game of Thrones." And like three other people, I loved playing it because I like Game of Thrones much more, but three other players around the table all had a hissy fit about getting sort of practically knocked out halfway through the game >> and I was like >> in Game of Thrones >> in Game of Thrones.
(1:13:30)  But I was like, well, this is what happens in TIA as well, so I don't know where you >> But anyway, so yeah, no, I wouldn't play her. >> Interesting. My final regret is the very first two board games that I purchased that got me into the hobby I sold. >> No. What were they? >> Mark Monk has one and he's still got it on the shelf cuz I believe he did a little video on his on his Tik Tok channel about this game.
(1:13:59)  But and you own the other. So, one of them is the Gears of War game by FFG. >> Oh, >> Mark Monk owns that. Nice. >> Uh, and the second one is the, forgive me, the year. Is it 2011 or 2012? >> Civilization. >> Civilization. >> Yeah, those two games I regret selling. >> Um, especially Civ because Yeah, Civ is an all day, >> but it's a cracking game.
(1:14:24) >> It's 5 hours. >> It's Yeah, I mean, it's going to be It's going to be a weekend game or a Friday night game, and you know, you're going to You got a late session. >> Midnight plus. >> Yeah. Um, which I wouldn't mind. I've I've not played it in so so long and I got rid of it. I really shouldn't have done cuz it's a cracking game.
(1:14:39) >> It is. >> Um you have to play with the expansions. >> You have to because it balances it out. >> And they they were very expensive. >> They were. Yeah, they were. Yeah. >> Um I I had the the whole set and I sold it and I really shouldn't have done as well as Gears of War which goes for a lot of money now cuz it's massively out of print especially the print andplay demand expansion pack that they did.
(1:14:58) >> Um and it's a real shame that I sold them but shouldn't should not have done that. That was that's really stupid. But then like you know you can go back to when you were a kid and think all those wonderful Nintendo games that you've had as a child and if you had them boxed and kept them really really nice and give it 20 years they'd be worth a fortune.
(1:15:15) >> Oh yeah. So I had um some Transformers toys from when I was a kid and I had three of them in box which were were my less like favorite Transformers. So they stayed in a box. >> Yeah. and the amount of money I got from them. And I looked at all my favorite Transformers that were out of box and battered and went, "Oh, if only I hadn't had as much fun as a kid.
(1:15:36)  They' all still be in boxes and I'd be rich." >> Oh, love that. Love that. >> Just looked up the cost of Wisdom and Warfare and it's tripled in price. >> How much is it? >> £160 is the cheapest I can see >> to be fair. I think that's pretty reasonable. >> So, yeah, one expansion for Battle Star Galactica as well. Yeah, >> similar.
(1:15:57)  I know it's like two of them together. They go from about 75 to 100 each the >> mentions of madness. Um and that concludes our gaming regrets. I enjoyed that folks. >> Um I probably could have kept going for hours as I've got many and I'm sure there'll be many more to come. Um let's go on to the uh the next bit. Right, folks. Connect four. Let's do it.
(1:16:28) Um, four cards coming out. I'm not going to shuffle them cuz you guys just did. Um, and we're going to think of a game that utilizes all four of those cards that come out. Here we go. Manufacturer SLindustry Farming. >> Tricky. >> Yeah. As soon as that second card goes, oh no. history. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Control.
(1:16:55) >> Oh, >> the closest I can think of, and I'm trying to struggle to get farming in there, is brass. Brass does a lot of elements of that. >> Area control area. Yeah, area control is a bit loose for brass, but but you are controlling specific areas within the map. >> Yeah, historic definitely manufactured. Definitely farming.
(1:17:15) I mean, they probably farmed the the hops ready for the maybe. >> Wow. >> What about scythe? >> Yeah, >> scythe. I think >> there sort of vague farming. >> It's not historic, but it's kind of alternate reality, isn't it? >> There is manufacturing industry in there and it is about airing control. >> No, I think that's the one I thought of.
(1:17:37) >> I think you hit it. Yeah. >> Yeah, cuz there are farms in it. So, although there isn't farming, there is a farm. So, surely that's got to count. Yeah, farm is one of the one of the terrain types, isn't it? >> Getting your workers to do it. It's just, you know, really loose. But yeah, >> I don't like the game, so I don't really want to say >> I remember teaching.
(1:17:51) >> We've got another in. >> Yeah, I was thinking that earlier actually, but I like I like that higher player counts. >> Five. I don't mind it. >> But but I don't I would I wouldn't want to play at two, >> but I would play it at three or higher. >> Yeah. Yeah. I think we we'd do another one. >> But you're very good at scythe.
(1:18:06) >> I'm not that good at scythe. You're very good at if I'm being honest. I'm better at traceron and I'm better at >> You are good at tracerion. Yeah, >> but Sy is just one of them that you've got to time that end. >> That's you don't even have to have a good game. If you time the end well, you you'll do very well.
(1:18:21) >> Yes. Um I'm up for I'm sure JP for a game of that. I got a copy. >> I talked about was it was it that he was talking about doing another Rise of Fenris campaign. >> I never did the first one. I just I did what they what some people like half people did like take the take the contents of it and just split it all open rather than going through it in story.
(1:18:39)  I've never did defenders campaign but and you know I normally say as a rule that I wouldn't be up for a campaign game but I would consider that if I had the time if I had the time. >> So other than scythe can we think of any others? >> No I think >> I think you've nailed it with that >> ascendancy. >> Yes. >> Yeah. >> Oh that's bringing back some memories.
(1:18:59) >> Yeah. So the ascendy 4x game or whatever it was called that we we tried. So that was again that was fantasy historic with Paul Groen was >> yeah that's got area control and it has manufacturing stuff >> but I'm not sure on the I think loosely >> I don't think farming stuff it's not a bad shell but I don't think it's as good as sy no say like Becky like it was the first thing that came to mind when I saw those come out I was like yep that's about as good as it's going to get I think um because otherwise it's again
(1:19:31) it's it's threes out of fours Um, >> let us know on the old socials if you can think of any other games that meet all those four. I don't know. >> Yeah, I can definitely think of a few. Like you said, the three out of four, but four out of four I think size for me. >> Yeah, it's area control. I think that's throwing it out cuz it then makes it like a a map >> Yeah.
(1:19:52) >> based game rather than >> It's the first one of four that I think I've ever thought of. >> Well done. >> Smashed it there. >> Smashed it. >> I think me and Adrian had the same thought, but you know. >> No. Yeah, you got to it first. If you've got any others, let us know on on Discord. >> I feel like like I always do with these, I'll walk away and then go, "Oh, of course. Totally forgot.
(1:20:12) " >> Nice. Let's um let's move on, shall we? >> So, now we're on our penultimate turn. So, um what have we got coming up, guys? What's uh what's around the corner? Beex, go with you first. >> Um, I've recently made a list of all the things that I still haven't played, like my shelf of shame basically, and there's some really like immediate obvious ones that I just want to want to get to to the table basically.
(1:20:50)  Um, some of the really basic ones like I still haven't played Ganson Clever and I know that's such a oldie. >> That's like a convention. >> Yeah, this is it. palette cleanser that is. >> Yeah. So, and a lot of them are really short like um fake artist goes to New York. Basically, I went through BG stats, the little >> sort of app that you can track all your games on and I filtered it by owned but not played.
(1:21:16) >> There was a massive list on there that made me a bit sad. >> Um, yeah. So, one of them is parks, Adrian. So, I might need you to teach me that, please. >> Yeah, thanks. Is that the the old because they've done a second edition of that, haven't they? >> Stop mentioning it. She thinks I swindle.
(1:21:34)  So, I did say to her, "Right, there's a new edition coming out. I'm selling off my first edition. I'll buy it." And then since then, I've got She's gone, "Well, I want the second edition now." >> To be honest, that game is right up your street. I used to own it. The first The first first edition was really pretty. >> First edition is much prettier.
(1:21:49)  Second edition comes with some of the expansions already in it. And I think it's just slightly clearer. And when you told me that, that is what persuaded me to buy it cuz a it's prettier and b the expansions that you're not that bothered. So I maybe I should I just need to play it. >> Pretty game. >> So yeah, I'm looking I'm looking to get some small games to the table that are quick to play just so I can tick them off really.
(1:22:12)  And and I have got a little about one, two, three, four, five games that are in my games to ditch pile. >> Yeah. >> What are they? We need to add a few more. >> Color brain. Bought that. It's a It's a big potato game. >> It's an activity game. Yeah, it's an activity. >> And I think Block Party is still really good and I like that.
(1:22:30)  So, I don't want to get rid of bit of that. Um, Harry Potter House Cup. >> Never played it. Watched a run through. >> Yeah. >> Looks just a bit simple, I think. >> It's a bit Yeah. Yeah. >> Um, Lantern's Dice. >> Okay. >> Never ever played that one. >> Supposed to be quite good. >> Bought it from Joel Yonks ago before I we even actually knew Joel properly.
(1:22:49)  Um, yeah. Venice. I need to get rid of that. But every time I take it to a bring a bite, there's about another four there. >> Um, and zombies with three exclamation marks. >> Oh, I forgot I even owned it. >> Steve Jackson game is in it. >> Yes, it is. I forgot I even owned it. >> Yeah, that's that's old. >> I don't think I'm going to be able to sell anything for any actual money, so I might just I don't know.
(1:23:08) >> That game had a billion expansions. >> It did. It did. And again, it's it's one of those where almost for historic purposes, it's probably worth giving a go. >> Well, yeah, but it's rolling move, isn't it? >> But it's roll. Yeah. It's not great. >> So, what what do you do with game? I guess I could donate them to gaming groups, which I'm more than happy to do.
(1:23:26) Um, maybe I just need to do that. >> Donate them to a charity shop of which someone who's not a gamer would pick it up. >> Yeah. >> Buy it, might like it, and go, "What other games of this type are there around?" >> Maybe I should do that. >> Or on the flip side of that, they can pick it up, realize that Becky's got a load of crap games, and then not get into board gaming because they were so crap.
(1:23:47) >> That's not very nice. >> There. That is another flip of the coin. >> That's not very nice. >> However, I didn't see it as glass half empty. >> No, >> just saying. >> Here I am thinking about doing a nice thing for humanity, donating stuff to a charity. >> Nice to have you around the table. >> All over it. >> Burn them. Yeah. Fuel.
(1:24:07) >> We need to have a talk about flipping how much we play Everdell and Wingspan. >> Oh, but we can't. >> Everell is a good like you have like that. You got the big box. >> We haven't got that to the table in about 18 months. I I sold mine like after expansion one cuz expansion one was never they got the big >> playansion fixes it in my opinion.
(1:24:25) >> Yeah I know you haven't played it. >> You don't have to put the tree out in the second expansion yourself. >> So we haven't played is it mist mistwood. >> Yeah. So the new one the standalone one came out. >> We haven't played farore either. >> Have you got the you got the two-player one? We got two player one now haven't they? >> Yeah.
(1:24:41) >> I'd be tempted to get that for the wife and I. We might b up get smashing out. >> I I love it. I really like the game, but I just don't think enough people others really like it for us to >> quite light. >> Yeah, >> I don't think it is. I think it's midweight base game. I'm not sure what it is with the expansion cuz I haven't played.
(1:25:00) >> Still midweight, I reckon. >> Maybe maybe just lower than midweight, but I >> mean, we're not talking about like I love it, but even it's not as light as like Lords of Water Deep or something that's light to medium. I think it's a bit more chewy than you want when you play a game like that. >> It's always a bit more efforty than I want to do.
(1:25:24)  If I've got evidel if I want effort wise, I'll play >> I don't know something that's a bit Yeah, maybe. Yeah. Or or just something that's a bit more Yeah, maybe. I was trying not to say those two games. >> I was literally trying to thinkame I was trying to think of another game. I know who I am. >> Um, yeah. I I just think that is if I wanted something lighter but still cutesy, I'm going to play Nocturn >> or >> Cascadia or something.
(1:25:52) >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Because they are lighter and cutesy. Cutesy, but >> yeah, they they they do what you want them to do. Whereas I think Everell is just a little bit more complex than I think I can be asked with if I want to play. >> I really really like it. It's just I don't think enough people other people do.
(1:26:10)  So >> yeah. >> So I think it might be one of them a reluctant sale. >> Get a good price for it though. >> Yeah. Same goes for Wingspan. Like you know it just >> I'm never getting rid of that. I'm never getting rid of that. >> I'm too invested in mine now. >> It's too beautiful. >> All right.
(1:26:23)  Well, we need to play it then. We need to put an event up for it or something because frankly it's >> the look of sadness. Sorry. Sorry. >> You'll have to play it then. >> Oh look. You look genuinely disappointed that someone was going to push you to play that game. >> I was thinking about the idea of parting with it and that's just I don't want to play that again and I I don't want to sell it.
(1:26:46) >> I know. I know it makes no sense. >> I'm going to get the new expansion soon and then I will probably put a game up. >> Yeah. >> So, um >> that's still not us playing our playing. >> Still not. But if you want to get if you want to scratch that itch without playing your coffee, you'll be able to. Um Curly, >> what have you got coming up? Uh it's a bit quiet actually coming up.
(1:27:07) Um I've been not taking a bit of a break, but we've had a few conventions lately and you know >> um so coming up I've just got a regular Elder Scrolls game. So Elder Scrolls um >> the first area. Uh no, it's me and Tambo. >> Oh, okay. >> Yeah. So we're trying to um we would have had Rob because Rob knows how to play and everything else, so it wouldn't have been too bad, but we wanted to keep it a low player count.
(1:27:31)  Um so we're playing two player. Um, yeah, really enjoying it. And we got another game tomorrow, which is cool. So, we're going to play that. Um, other than that, just for a massive change, I'm gonna go and play Art Nova with Jack. >> Yes, >> with Jack and Cole. So, who I haven't seen for, you know, we haven't we haven't chilled out together for a while, so that's nice.
(1:27:51) >> Yeah, but yeah, but that was a big campaign Imperium game, you know, so it doesn't really count. But we decided to play a game of Arnov. We used to play a lot more regularly. >> Yeah, we did. So yeah, I'm going to get another game in with them uh on Wednesday. So looking forward to that as well. So >> yeah, those are the two things I'm looking forward to.
(1:28:09)  Other than that, I' I've got to put some games up in after game basically. Um which I was planning on doing um after the last convention I haven't bothered yet. So there's a few games on my hit list I want to get in. So yeah. >> Yeah. Nice. >> Looking forward to getting a few games into the calendar. >> Nice.
(1:28:27)  I'm going to try and do the same after I come back from Disney. Um cuz I'm missing having a couple because in the calendar which leads me on to me I guess but Disney. Yeah. >> Um I've got Disney >> but yeah Disney post. >> You're going to have lots of fun. >> I'm going to have lots of fun. I'm going to need a week off afterwards to recover which I don't have.
(1:28:47) >> So is your bank account. >> So is my bank account. Yeah. I've got I got a little nest egg there of money saves ready to go in there. Um but um yeah, that's it's going to be an expensive week, but I'm looking forward to it. It should be good. Um, but before that, I am playing a two-player version of Civera on Tuesday night.
(1:29:07)  Um, >> how does that play two player? >> It's shorter. Not obviously shorter because of the player count, but it's shorter round count. So, they they make the rounds make the game one round smaller. Um, but I think it plays nice. It doesn't it's not as cutthroaty as a grier. >> Um, there are, you know, when someone takes a space, there are still other spaces that you can, you know, you're not you're not completely blocked out like a like a griler is.
(1:29:28)  Um, and so it plays quite nice. So a friend of mine is looking after our guinea pigs. >> So Nate, good old Nate Dog if you're listening. >> Um, so Nate, love you Nate. So he's he's going to look after. So he needs to be taught how to look after said guinea pigs while we're away. >> I say by playing a gria that >> and then after that I said let's play something.
(1:29:48)  What do you fancy say play a conver? Yeah. Go on then. So we're going to play a quick game of that before he goes. It won't take long. It'll take 90 minutes if that. Um, so I am going to get a game in before we go, which is good. And then it's my birthday in a few days. >> It is. >> Happy birthday, Dad. >> I'm going to be old. Um, >> hey, watch out.
(1:30:06) >> Join the join. >> Three years younger than me. >> Join the I am. I This is true. >> You don't look it, but >> I don't I don't look it. I don't look it. Um, I know that I look much much younger than you. >> Um, but yeah. >> Yeah, that's what I meant. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
(1:30:23)  Um, Adrian, what have you got planned? couple of things. Um, so it's a little bit further off, but going back to an old Stone Meer game. So, we've been sent Euphoria. >> Euphoria. Yeah. >> And want to give that a go. Um, cuz No, never played it before and heard sort of decent things about it. So, I want to give that a go.
(1:30:43)  And then out of nowhere, having hunted for for it for ages, the first expansion for Underwater Cities randomly hit just a couple of retailers. And I previously, I know some people did buy it for like 5060 imported. >> Wow. >> Um, and I found somewhere that had it for 32 quid. So, um, I've got new dis underwater city new discoveries coming through and so it will probably be the first game I put up to play on my table.
(1:31:12) >> Do you have the first edition of the base game or the second? >> No, I have the delicious games version of Yeah, I had the very, very first version of it. the blue. Was it blue? It wasn't blue orange, was it? It was >> No, I can't remember the name, but I Yeah, I can't I can see the logo, but I can't remember the name of it.
(1:31:28) >> That's why I'm thinking of it as an orange. It's cuz it's a >> I can't Yeah, but >> it's a Rio Grande. >> Was it Rio Grande? It's a sun. It's the sun, isn't it? And I was thinking it was >> Do you know what? I might have had Delicious Games with this version, actually. >> With a cupcake on it. >> It might have been, but it was the one where they don't have the dual layer boards.
(1:31:46) >> No, that's in the expansion. That's why I've bought the expansion is because that's what has the dual >> a second edition of it. >> No, they did, but it still doesn't have >> still doesn't have that. So, um that's why I've bought that's why I was desperate to get the expansion. >> Asked the guys when they were in Essen to pick it up and they waited till like day three to go and have a look and it's all sold out.
(1:32:06) >> No shade. Um >> no salt. >> Yeah. And then I was like, well, I'm going to have to wait till lesson next year to pick it up. And then randomly just happened to be looking on uh boardame prices.co.uk UK to see what was going on and noticed that it was on sale at a couple of places. So, I've placed an order.
(1:32:25)  So, assuming that turns up and it wasn't some massive catfish of in stockness, then uh that will be my probably my first game night I put up on the new table. >> Count me in. >> Yeah, >> I really enjoyed the player the base game. >> Yeah. Again, I don't even know if I'll throw in the actual extras. I just wanted the dual playerboard. >> But yeah, great game. Great.
(1:32:48) >> Nice. So, um, that's it then. That's it. >> That's it. >> That's it then. >> Yeah. >> And with that, folks, our final turn is wrapping up and victory points are being scored. Curley's probably won. Uh, thanks everyone for listening. >> So many people outro that way with going is probably Curly who's won.
(1:33:06)  Yeah, it's quite a common weird. >> I will argue, but I've got a good record. It's going well. I didn't realize that was a thing. >> Yeah, it's like a just turns up like maybe one in six episode outros. It's probably Curly. >> Probably Curly is one. He probably has. Um, but if you have enjoyed our show, please uh give us a like, subscribe, and review us on your podcast player of choice.
(1:33:27)  And we ask you to share our podcast around because we like people to uh to hear us and spread our love. Um, also, if you want to support the show in different ways, become a subscriber. Uh, and you can do that via our coffee uh website, um, Kofi. Um, give us your money and support us that way. That'd be great.
(1:33:46)  Um, but um, until uh, until the next time. Whose turn is it? Regrettably, it's Curies.